1. Ieronymos: “We must return to tradition again. If baptism occurs at a young age, it is because, within the Church, the feeling was created that the child grows up in an environment of Christian principles.”

Elpidophoros: “I absolutely agree with His Beatitude what he said. Because we read the same Gospel, we teach the same Gospel, and there could not be any different opinion on this matter”.   He Agrees!! But he doesn’t feel the need to ask for forgiveness for his mistake in July of 2022!!

By Nick Stamatakis 

The ultimate double-faced Phanariot Elpidophoros made one more flip-flop of many he has performed recently. While yesterday he was claiming “We are a different Church in America,” today he insisted that “we read the same Bible.”… Typical Elpidophoros… But the big news (below is a full report) is what you just read in our subtitle: The expression of opinion by AB Ieronymos that children of gay couples should be baptized later in life.  Where to start with such a position?

  • Shouldn’t he underline first that same-sex couples should NOT be allowed to have children?  Yes, he should.  But, I believe intentionally, he left the whole issue open to keep the debate going on the wrong foundation.
  • On the surface, we certainly should let them grow up, be catechized, and learn what the Bible says by attending special classes in Church.
  • But if we allow children to be raised in such circumstances, we risk a lot. First, as we all know from introductory psychology, by age 10, children have formed their essential personality traits.  How will a child without a mother or a father figure in their lives be developed? Not normally, of course.  Second, without any “natural” concept of family when they need it the most, what are we talking about? Will we offer “catechism” to these children when they lack the concept of family – so essential for so many teachings of the Church?
  • Again, if you want to put the issue on the proper foundation go back and read Met. Mesogaias Nikolaos’ speech… It is as clear as day: Children have the right to grow with a mother and a father as Nature prescribes. Christianity and other religions follow Nature as Anastasios of Albamnia, so aptly noted: The unnatural is not made natural by legal decrees!

As you can see, the issue is more complicated than it looks on the surface.  But it offers all of us the right choice of the problem at hand: If the Greek state allows same-sex marriage, then adoption will inevitably be applied by the courts.  And if it is applied, then we are faced with a multiple set of problems about the adopted children and their normal growth, much larger than their “baptism” to Christianity.  Before they are baptized Christians, they will already be baptized in a sinful behavior!  Therefore, the right choice is to stay with the civil union and never allow the adoption of children by same-sex couples!!

Please do not tell me that there are studies that prove that these children of same-sex couples grow up normally – because there are not! They are too few, lack documentation, and most are fake! The only studies that exist – backed by millions of cases in Family/Divorce Court – are those that prove that children need a father and a mother!! (If I see any comment denying this FACT, it will automatically be deleted!)

Furthermore, Elpidophoros’s words, at some point, have to mean something.  I have heard the same story from many people who met him: He smiles, opens his mouth, and promises all kinds of things, and weeks or months later, he does nothing of what he has promised! His word means nothing!! If he had an ounce of decency, when he said he agreed with AB Ieronymos on baptism at a later point, he would grab the opportunity to apologize for his action on the infamous “gay marriage” of July 2022.  He did not, and he looked again like the double-faced Phanariot he truly is!!

Finally, during his visit with the President of Greece, Mrs. Sakellaropoulou, he presented himself in charge of the Independence Parade, especially regarding the Evzones’ invitation.  Last year, the Parade Committee was headed by his representative, Fr. Evagoras (Constantinides). Although it was supposed to be part of the NY Federation’s Parade Committee, they never accounted for their proceeds!! And it was known that they had a decent profit of about $20,000 or maybe more!!  In addition, Elpidophoros is pushing reconciliation with the Sultans of Ankara – as they still threaten Greece – just because he wants to be the next Patriarch and needs their favor!!  What a shame for our community and the Federation to have this true Turk, Elpidoktonos, be involved in our Parade!!  It defies the meaning of the Parade!! Sometimes I wish that the Turks do as they regularly threaten and invade an island soon – so everybody can see the true face of Elpidoktonos!! Are we going to forget that Pat. Bartholomew blessed the Turkish Army as it illegally invaded Syria!! And two years later, he had the gall to accuse Patriarch Kirill of Moscow of blessing the Russian Army!!

The Turks should not have any place in Our Church and Community!! Autocephaly NOW! 

January 25, 2023, n.stamatakis@aol.com   www.helleniscope.com

DISCLAIMER: The views and statements expressed in this article constitute constitutionally protected opinions of this author.

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BELOW IS THE VIDEO WITH AB IERONYMOS AND AB ELPIDOPHOROS – FOLLOWED BY THE NEWS

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source – greekcitytimes.com

Archbishop Ieronymos: Children of same-sex couples will decide whether to be baptised when they grow up

The position of the Church on the marriage of same-sex couples became known after the meeting of the Holy Synod and is categorically negative, without raising the tone between the State and the Church.

The Primate of the Church, Archbishop of Athens Ieronymos II, distinguished same-sex and heterosexual couples during his meeting with the Archbishop of America, Elpidophoros. The meeting of the two church leaders lasted forty minutes and discussed issues of current church affairs.

Mr. Ieronymos spoke about the issue of baptizing the children of same-sex couples, saying that the Church will wait for them to grow up for them to decide for themselves whether or not they wish to be baptized.

Answering a question on baptism, His Beatitude, Mr. Ieronymos emphasized that “we must return to tradition again. If baptism occurs at a young age, it is because, within the Church, the feeling was created that the child grows up in an environment of Christian principles. Therefore, teachings were unnecessary because they took place within the environment. Now that things are changing, we are not against children. We love and care about children more than anyone else. The Church will wait for these children to reach an age, and when they grow up and wish to be baptized, they will be baptized.”

In response to the same question, the Archbishop of America, Mr. Elpidophoros, emphasized: “I absolutely agree with His Beatitude what he said. Because we read the same Gospel, we teach the same Gospel, and there could not be any different opinion on this matter”.

Mr. Elpidophoros, responding to the same issue, said, “I have nothing to add; his Beatitude said everything.”

After the meeting, Mr. Elpidophoros made the following statement:

“The political leaderships of the two countries are showing the right path, that the USA and Greece are working together for the benefit of both sides. Indeed, the Church preceded this communion because we always come together. The Church of Greece is the Church of our homeland, of all expatriates.

“As we love the country, we also love its Church. Expatriates are always at the disposal of His Beatitude and the Church of Greece, in good times as well as in difficult times. As in natural disasters, fires and floods, but also in the joys of our homeland, we are always on the side of the Church and Greece.”

For his part, His Holiness said: “I would like to agree with the Most Reverend Archbishop and emphasize that this kind of meeting, the exchange of views, this cooperation benefits both our side and the Orthodox Church of America.

“There is a common point that we must especially emphasise: the Patriarchate is the place that connects us to the two Churches. This is the heart of Orthodoxy, and we should strive to work so that this cooperation and unity will benefit the Church and our country.”

Answering journalists’ questions about the current situation, His Holiness emphasized that “freedom in man is a very important thing, and we must all consider this. And the Church, but also the State.”

Archbishop Ieronymos concluded that neither the Church should have the bayonet ready nor should the State want to put shackles on any place in our country”.

The Most Reverend Archbishop of America was accompanied by the High President of AHEPA, Mr. Savvas Tsivikos, the Vice President of the National Benevolent Brotherhood of the Archdiocese of America, Mrs. Annita Kartalopoulou, the businessman Mr. Steve Zervoudis and Rev. Protopresbyter Fr. Alexandros Karloutsos.

Greece faces Orthodox Church opposition over same-sex marriage plans

Greece’s center-right government is speeding up its timetable to legalize same-sex marriage – despite growing opposition from the powerful Orthodox Church.

Government officials said the draft legislation would be put to a vote by mid-February. Greece would become the first Orthodox-majority country to legalise same-sex marriage if the law passes.

The Ecumenical Patriarchate in Istanbul, which heads Orthodox churches around the world, has expressed its opposition to the same-sex marriage proposal.

“Marriage is the union of man and woman under Christ… and the church does not accept the cohabitation of its members in any form other than marriage,” the Ecumenical Patriarchate said.

It echoed a decision by the church’s senior bishops in Greece earlier this week.

Metropolitan Bishop Panteleimon, a spokesman for the Greek Church’s governing Holy Synod, said that its written objections would be sent to all members of Greece’s parliament and read out at Sunday services around the country on 4 February.

“What the church says is that marriage is the union of a man and a woman, and that is the source of life,” he told private Skai television. “The elders of our church are concerned with defending and supporting the family.”

Panteleimon also said it was too soon to comment on the approach that the church would take towards the children of same-sex parents.

Conservative Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis, who won a landslide re-election victory last summer, will likely need to rely on opposition party votes for the measure to be approved. He faces dissent from within the governing New Democracy party as well as from members of his own Cabinet.

“We are talking about something that is already in effect in 36 countries and on five continents. And nowhere does it appear to have damaged social cohesion,” Mitsotakis told his ministers in a televised statement Wednesday.

“I want to be clear: We are referring to choices made by the state and not religious convictions… Our democracy requires that there cannot be two classes of citizens and there certainly cannot be children of a lesser god.”

Recent opinion polls suggest that Greeks narrowly oppose same-sex marriage, with conservative voters more clearly opposed.

18 COMMENTS

    • I would suggest that we refrain from name calling. If we want to be taken seriously, categorizing anyone as demonic, is self degrading. You are not harming the person that you’re calling demonic. You’re hurting your own reputation.

  1. Since Archbishop of America, Mr. Elpidophoros, has not apologized for baptizing those children, nor he has done anything wrong; it shows you that he has an enormous ego(egoizmo) like Satan. And perhaps he and Patr. Bartholomew are homosexuals themselves; since they admit no sin or wrong doing for their actions! (and in other cases as well). Therefore we do not need them in our Orthodoxy Church as leaders. We will not accept nor respect such hypocrites, double faced and evil so called leaders .They need to go! ASAP!

    • Grace.
      We should all refrain from categorizing anyone as “probably homosexual”. unless we have evidence. If you consider yourself Christian, then you are committing a great sin. And how do you connect “that they dont admit any sin” to being homosexuals? There are plenty of other, provable things that they have done, that we can hold them to account. Let’s stick with the truth

    • See… Judas Schismatophoros also believes he did God’s work by doing the baptism… like many people fooled by Satan they rationalize and justify their evil deed. The main Satanic strategem is to usurp the words of the Scripture, distort them in order to do the Devil’s work, create scandal, schisma and turmoil in the Church. If the Boussis family didn’t bribe Judas Schismatophoros the baptism wouldn’t have taken place. That’s why I call him Judas. Judas Schismatophoros knew he was desecrating in the most blasphemous way the Holy Sacrament of Baptism, of Holy Communion (he already did that when he is allowing the multiple spoons etc… That’s another big can of worms we don’t talk much about) because he knows the people that brought the babies to him are intentionally or by ignorance disrespecting the faith. Also think the harm that will be done to these kids… Ever anyone thought of that? Being denied their mother for the rest of their lives! Demonic evil through and through…

  2. While I read Helleniscope frequently I hardly comment. But I must say the news over the last few weeks has been literally mind boggling and things are now reaching a boiling point in my opinion.

    The article published on Helleniscope on January 22nd on exapsalmos.gr of Sotiris Tzoumas linked to a foundation associated with Simonos Petras.

     https://simonopetrafoundation.org/about-us/

    It peaked my curiousity to look at the various bios of the board. Many of the usual players we see in regards to the who’s who in the Archdiocese leadership as well as clear leaders from industry.

    Also I couldn’t help but contemplate what the future of our church would look like if His Eminence Archbishop Elpidophoros was currently Patriarch. I could see a real lack of order throughout the ranks of the laity and the clergy.

    I agree that the church of America must seperate itself administratively from the Ecumenical Patriarch as promptly as possible. Mount Athos ought to do so also, no matter what benefactors have to say about it.

    If the Turks make a play on Greek soil, the Patriachate will have sanctioned it. We must be rigirously honest here and not look the other way and tell ourselves half truths.

    This trip to Athos could have been an opportunity to make peace with the Russians, and do some real soul searching. While there might be some of that going on, that is not the perception I am getting.

    We need stronger leadership, both from the heirarchy of the clergy and the laity. Despite the current leadership’s shortcomings, I continue to pray for them, and for myself to be a more understanding and patient person.

  3. On the surface, Ieronymos’ comment about these children being baptized later in life (if they choose to be Orthodox) makes sense…a pagan or muslim couple can’t simply show up and say “I want you to baptize my child, but I’ll raise it to believe my principles”, and then expect that the Church will willingly baptize the child… Don’t look at today’s “luke warm” approach, where a “factory of Chrismations without proper Catechism” is observed…the original practice of the Orthodox Church was very strict about who was allowed to be baptized and who wasn’t…

    So, on the surface, Ieronymos’s comment is consistent with ancient ecclesiastical tradition. However, looking at the same comment from a different angle:

    Why is Ieronymos speaking in a way that makes it appear the law is already passed, and that this situation of adoption is already in force? He should have said “the fight is not over”, or “we will not passively accept what the government is trying to do”….instead, his word choice clearly shows that he has “accepted” that this is now a “de facto” reality. He has colluded with Mitsotakis to minimize resistance in order to favor the passing of this legislation. Shame.

      • He pretends to be meek and loving… Remember what Jesus Christ did to those that had turned the temple into a marketplace… He turned the tables upside down… That was not an action of meekness and servile docility… A leader quite often has to make the proverbial omelette… You can’t make that without breaking some eggs

  4. Trumps’ church, .marblechurch.org, practices infant baptism because they are Durch Reformed. Many of the original protestant churches retained infant baptism.

  5. Universal Audience of Ultimate Truth for Salvation

    Ultimately all ethics depends on individual consideration, mandated in Leviticus 19:18 “Love your neighbor as yourself,” also found in Confucius Analects 12:2, Buddhist Udana Vagna 5:1 and Matthew 7:1. Consistency is the hobgoblin of limited minds as God and Truth are incomprehensible (Isaiah 40:25) and dogma and ideology are idolatry which detracts from evidence based realism. This is why the only answer can be a question. All creativity and science is divine (1 Cor 3:5-9). Jesus opposed traditionalist Sadducees and fundamentalist Pharisees but embraced syncretic Samaritans. Jesus was nothing if not anticlerical “Do as they say, not as they do” (Mt 23:1). Isn’t it odd the fundamentalists quote scripture by number as if lawyers? Meek means tranquil, not humble. Meekness is devoid of the passion of just war which divides and obfuscates. (Jer 17:9, Eph 2:3). God expected his prophets to question his wrath and tormented them when they didn’t so he expects us to interrogate his scriptures (John 5:39, Matthew 6:34), valuing difficult questions.

    Hades (Sheol) was a holding place from which Jesus freed us, not a banishment. “gather his wheat into the barn, but the chaff he will burn”. (Matthew 3:12 ) There is no purgatory, burning is into oblivion. “I assure you, today you will be with me in paradise.” (Luke 23:43 ) Today! Saints intecede! If Jesus told us to be like the children (Matt 18:3) how could he believe them to have Original Sin? Mary CHOSE, by Free Will, to be sinless and surrendered herself to the service of God, as God long awaited (Luke 1:30). Luther said “Mary is rightly called not only the mother of the man, but also the Mother of God” (24:107) and “There can be no doubt that the Virgin Mary is in heaven. How it happened we do not know.” (10:268). God lived in the Temple (Exodus 36:8) so as Mary bore God she replaced the Temple which was destroyed when she rose exactly on Tisha B’Av, the original lent of eating only fish because fish survived Noah’s flood.

    God is beyond time and reason, not being limited by the dimensions that govern our world (Isaiah 57:15). God’s perspective on time is far different from man (Psalm 102:12, 24-27). God sees all of eternity’s past and eternity’s future, hence free will and predestination do not contradict. Since He is the Alpha AND the Omega, there can be no historical progression which is satanic anthropolatry. Parable of Talents (Matt 25:14-30) confirms the glory of capitalism over slothful envy of socialism. Parable of Warehouse is about being obsessed with what we have so we stop living. Superachievers aren’t concerned with accumulation but with constant achievement, seeking to ever use their gifts to the fullest (Calvin Institutes 3.7.5). James 2:14-18,26 shows that while faith is the essential prerequisite, you cannot escape the need for works as well. Half the planet worships to the Psalms of David so stop renaming them as your own hymnals. A Republic of Judges was preferred by God over the Reign of Kings. (1 Sam 8:6-18) The clothing and responsibilities of the Cohens (chief priests) resembles the early bishops (overseers) and of rabbis with the pastors (presbyters, elders). Paul’s word for fornication meant prostitution instead. Paul’s word for masturbation meant malady. Paul’s word for sycophant meant slander. Magog meant Mongol. Jesus came to fulfill not repeal the Law (Matt 5:17) as Pharisees were condemned because they syncretized vindictive Roman natural law over Jubilee redemptory Deuteronomy law. Moneychangers were racist about Roman coins. Redemptory confession is from 2 Chron 7:14 and Resurrection from Dan 12:2, Ezek 37:12-17, and Isaiah 26:19. Forgiveness is found in Isaiah 33:24, Isaiah 55:7, Jeremiah 3:22, Numbers 14,15, Leviticus 6,19,2 Samuel 14:14. Repentance and forgiveness is the undoing of time. Jesus used the lunar calendar, so why do you use the calendar of those that slew him and stole his religion.

    • Hey Mark
      Relatively long post, with too many biblical references, which might discourage readers from reading it and they certainly wont fact check all your references. I use bible references also. Only one or two per letter. Orthodoxy is also Apostolic. So, Bible quotes are combined with the apostolic tradition, to create Orthodoxy. Bible quoting is employed by the evangelicals. Which they hardly ever follow anyway. Botom line, I agree with the basics of your letter

    • In general I believe we should have our eyes open to the world, to other religions. But this doesn’t mean that we can used “comparative religion” as a social science discipline, to concoct a monstrous pan-religion and level the wonderful teachings of our Faith. Especially for us Greeks, this has a special meaning as we know that from the classics to stoicism to the cosmopolitan Alexandrian/Hellenistic times, our ancestors created the basic concepts that gave birth to Christianity. Let’s be clear at this moment because there are many degenerate globalists that promote “Pan-religion” for their own de-humanizing and selfish reasons. Anything that makes it easier for these satanists to control humanity is blessed.

      • Hey Nick.
        I agree with you. Christianity would not have been a world religion, if it wasn’t for Greek philosophy. It would have stayed an insignificant Jewish sect, same as the one that is worshipping the dead rabbi Schneerson in Brooklyn, that had dug the illegal tunnel. And BTW, Mark Elmer Scott used more bible references and longer post than I ever did and you published it. Just saying. I am hoping for fairness and no derisive name calling I do agree with Mark Elmer’s reasoning.

        • Thanks to you and so many of our readers, some of whom you met here, I am being fed every hour interesting information from everywhere. Some of it refers to problems and even financial and other scandals in parishes and metropolises. Helleniscope practices “people’s journalism” in many ways. You are they eyes and ears of this community.
          Thank you for alerting me. It helps. But when it comes to news from Greece I am usually the one who picks up anything interesting first thing in the morning. When we wake up here, Greece is already in the middle of the day and most of the news has come out…

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