Greek Migration and Asylum Minister Thanos Plevris of New Democracy has no business talking about self-defense and gun ownership.
He insisted on strict gun-ownership laws at a time when there was rising crime from illegal migrants from Asia and Africa. There are narco-terrorists dealing drugs from South America in Greece. Albanian mafia gangs are operating alongside some Greeks. There are also illegal migrants from Asia and Africa engaged in crimes against Greeks.
President Trump is deporting illegals in the USA. I suggest that Thanos Plevris meet with Trump’s administration to learn how to remove all illegals from Greece quickly. Thanos has an important job to do.
Crime is rampant across Greece. The real government statistics are never shown. The average citizen knows the Greek government lies. Politicians like Thanos Plevris, a former LAOS party member, have armed Greek security provided by the government, while the average Greek is defenseless.
Also, Greece needs to be more like Idaho, USA. If every Greek household owned pistols and rifles, the Muslim Turkish military would face 10 million Greeks ready to act as snipers on our own land.
Do you think Turkey would think twice about invading Greek land if every Greek owned a pistol or a rifle?
When the Nazi German military invaded Crete in 1941, it was the armed Cretans who fought back and killed the German paratroopers as they landed. The Greek civilians who owned rifles in 1941 played a major role in stopping the invading Nazi force.
The Battle of Crete was the last time Nazi Germany used large-scale parachute troops.
Today, the ordinary Greek must stand outside his home with no means of self-defense, according to Greek law. This has to change now.
I support Idaho-style gun ownership across Greece. Law-abiding Greeks must be allowed to conceal-carry loaded pistols, small knives, pepper spray, etc. American citizens can conceal-carry pistols across the USA. An armed citizen is a major obstacle to violent criminals who want to rape Greek women or commit murders.
Guns save lives in the USA.
Globalist elites like George Soros fund anti-gun groups and Democrats in the USA. Why? Because these elites do not want an armed citizenry with pistols, shotguns, or rifles who could stand against a globalist-imposed dictatorship.
The reason there is no globalist tyrant in Washington, D.C., is that millions of Americans own weapons. The reason Communist China cannot invade the USA is that it would face an army of millions of armed Americans.
Greece needs to look at why Idaho is a safe place. It’s because everyone carries a gun. Criminals do not want a grandmother or woman with a loaded pistol in her purse who can defend herself.
Greeks across Greece are left vulnerable to home invasions, rapes, and dangerous illegals from Asia and Africa with criminal records.
Greeks in the USA will tell you how they are armed and trained by gun instructors. In recent years, Greek Americans have fled high-crime, Democrat-run states like California, New York, and Illinois for Republican, pro-gun states like Texas, Florida, Arizona, Nevada, Idaho, Wyoming, Alabama, and South Carolina.
Why are crime rates lower in pro-gun states where citizens are allowed to conceal-carry?
Is this why Greece is afraid to give ethnic Greeks in the USA the right to vote in Greece, even if they hold Greek citizenship and a passport?
I urge Thanos Plevris—whom I spoke to in person while he was an LAOS party parliament member—to read John R. Lott Jr.’s book More Guns, Less Crime.
Thanos Plevris needs to focus on his job and deport all illegals from Asia, Africa, and the Americas from Greece. Dangerous criminals with records are committing rapes, burglaries, home invasions, and petty theft against the average ethnic Greek Christian citizen.
Amen!
“””Also, Greece needs to be more like Idaho, USA. If every Greek household owned pistols and rifles, the Muslim Turkish military would face 10 million Greeks ready to act as snipers on our own land.””
Don’t you think that the numbers of guns in civilian hands to be used against an enemy army is 20th cedntury thinking? Those armed civilians will be fodder for the millions of drones Turkey produces and will deploy. As a matter of fact, Nikos Dendias, just two days ago said that soldiers now don’t need to have weapons. They need to be trained in operating drones.
“”Guns save lives in the USA.””. How do you arrive at that conclusion? The UK’s total homicides last year wer 700 people. If we corelate that number to the US population, our homicide total would have been 3500. It stands at 20,000. And the UK has plenty of those Africans, Asians and South Americans that Greece also has, that you blame for rising crime.
“”Why are crime rates lower in pro-gun states where citizens are allowed to conceal-carry?”” Not true. Massachussets, an anti-gun State has thew lowest crime rate in the nation. As a matter of fact, out of the top 10 states with the lowest crime, only one is a gun nut state.
Obviously, you’re making up statistics as you go. You are untethered to the reality of America’s special problem. The greatest killer of American children is not cancer or accidents. It is guns.
Let’s not forget the ironic paradox that the majority of Greek males have to serve in the military, where they in theory learn how to handle a weapon…so the government actually trains them for free at a young age… but forbids them from bearing arms as private citizens…
The definition of “self-defense” isn’t very good in current Greek Law…it usually turns out ok in court if a home owner strikes an intruder holding a knife or a firearm with fists, because the theory in that case is you are using “less dangerous means” to defend yourself (good luck surviving in that scenario however)…but if the home owner grabs a kitchen knife or a hunting shotgun from the closet to “even the odds” or dare to “gain the upper hand”, the prosecutors will say he escalated the situation and became the aggressor in his own home…hurting his “uninvited guest”…and being guilty of assault and more…(in his own home)…
Ironically, in private (off the record), some members of the Greek police advise concerned citizens that the incident never be reported, and the body of the intruder should be buried in a way that it will never be found…
Finally, the elitist politicians like Plevris don’t care, because they have armed police guarding them and their families 24 x 7, while community police stations and neighborhood patrol routes remain significantly understaffed, especially in rural locations and at night in big cities…
Ελλας το μεγαλειο σου!
Markos. I can’t think of the last time that a scenario such as you mentioned has taken place, with the homeowner defending his home and being charged as a criminal. Let’s face it. Greeks hardly ever go to jail. You always hear that someone was given a 6 month sentence with “anastoli”.
Laws in Greece are made to be broken. If there are laws on the books as you describe, which is not unusual, those laws are not being enforced.
Guns in civilian hands ask for trouble. Look what happened in Crete just recently. Which is why Plevris wants to tighten the law on weapons. Greeks are hot blooded. They get mad too easily. They’ll use those weapons and declare themselves judge, jury and executioner. Too many children have lost their lives in Crete and near Tsiganeis’ camps, from balothies.
Bob,
You really need to tune into current events a bit better.
Some stuff makes the media (see links below), but there is a lot of stuff that doesn’t make the media. If you aren’t in the neighborhood, you won’t hear about it.
This past March 25th, the majority of a village I am very familiar with was at the festivities at the Church & school parade when a team of 3 gypsies was spotted attempting to burglarize yet another house at the very edge of the village (one guy in the getaway car, one outside the house, and one inside the house)…a phone call was made to the home owner by the neighbor that saw them, and within 90 seconds, several motorcycles showed up from the village center…Let’s just say “reliable” rumor has it that the guy that was caught inside the house required between 5 & 6 hours of reconstructive jaw surgery a couple days later, among many other painful orthopaedic diagnoses (at least he is alive, right?)… the police officer that made the official arrest of all 3 “gentlemen” also provided the official police report of the injuries sustained…”the burglars got startled, jumped out of the window, and hurt themselves upon hitting the ground”… (a.k.a. you will find nothing in the media)
In the early 1990s, at another village nearby (not Crete, by the way), two migrants that were seen entering someone’s home were also intercepted by the owner after he was tipped off by a neighbor driving by who saw suspicious activity… There are “strong rumors” in the region that those two burglars “disappeared” forever, with no police reports, no missing person reports, etc… (a.k.a. nothing in the media)
These accounts and many more aren’t fiction, and whether or not your diagnosis of “hot blooded Greeks” is true, it is a fact in recent decades that “home invasion” crime has risen because criminals have been emboldened by a combination of “lack of police presence” plus “lack of legal ability to effectively defend yourself and your property” in Greece. If the Greek government is unwilling or incapable of increasing effective police presence, then the government should allow people to defend themselves…those are the options here. Mr. Plevris is not solving anything with his stated positions.
But in order to convince you that some stuff does make the media, here’s one from Giannena (not Crete) from 2023:
https://www.tastv.gr/article/71hronos-skotose-me-oplo-ton-klefti-poy-mpike-sto-spiti-toy
here’s one from Kilkis (not Crete):
https://www.1077statusfm.gr/news/99-news/66033-kilkis-54-pyrovolise-kai-skotose-45xrono-eikazetai-ypothesi-klopis.html
And here is one from Crete 2013:
https://www.newsit.gr/egklhma/kriti-ton-synelavan-giati-pyrovolise-toys-kleftes/1756263/
There are a ton more, so you should really tune in a bit better next time before you “can’t think of the last time a scenario” like this happened..
Of course, the reason for all this is what we stated above…absence of police, especially in rural areas has made it a “free-for-all” for emboldened criminals…leaving no option to the residents but to take the law into their own hands…and unfortunately, the “leaving no witnesses behind” scenario actually provides the highest probability of avoiding prosecution for “hurting someone while defending your property”…
And why are many Greeks these days psychologically capable of such an “angry” response?
While it may be true that “many children have been hurt by balothies” in Crete, it is also true that FAR MANY MORE elderly people have been tortured and murdered by criminals entering their homes the past few years across the remainder of Greece, and many of the “hot-blooded Greeks” have had enough of that…
If you are not convinced that this is a problem in modern-day Greece, here are a few links I was able to grab in 20 seconds from a simple search (there are MANY more out there):
https://www.aftodioikisi.gr/koinonia/larisa-katadikastikan-oi-listes-poy-vasanisan-kai-skotosan-ilikiomeno/
https://www.newsbomb.gr/ellada/story/249039/egklima-stin-patra-vasanisan-kai-skotosan-ilikiomeni
https://www.news247.gr/ellada/kakopoiisan-kai-skotosan-86xroni-gia-na-ti-listepsoun/
https://www.koutipandoras.gr/article/agria-dolofonia-stin-halkida-fimosan-kai-vasanisan-ilikiomeno-gia-mia-hoyfta-eyro/
Mr. Plevris and other politicians should focus on fixing the root cause, and people will be more inclined to change their behaviors accordingly… allowing for reasonable self-defense (based on the castle doctrine), and increasing police presence will contribute to making criminals “less bold” in the future.
Markos
The links that you sent only tell us that the shooter, who is the homeowner was taken in for questioning. They dont tell us if he was actually convicted and went to prison. My post was questioning how many actually are convicted of killing in self defense and do time. Hardly any Greeks ever see the inside of a prison cell. Prisons are for Albanians, Africans and all the non-Europeans.
I live in N.J. The law here is also “liberal”, where you are legally not allowed to kill in defense of your home.
My house was burgled and I know how it feels. The damn insurance don’t cover anything. My wife’s diamond engagement ring was stolen and they wanted receipts. We were married for 30 years at the time. Who has a receipt?. No one was home.
Its true that Greece is facing a crime wave. My sister lives in Athens and the door of her apartment has more locks than a prison cell. She says most of the criminals are foreigners. And I have read about so many older people, living in villages abandfoned by the young, have been tortured and killed. But an old yiayia, who can hardxly see or move, you can’t expect her to be waiting for burglars with a shotgun at the ready. Read yoiur links. They are all victims in their 80’s.
I have no problem with defending your home. Do you seriously think that those elderly would have been able to defend themselves with a firearm?
I agree that the root cause should be fixed. That’s easier said than done. Even a healthy economy won’t fix the crime problem. It didn’t fix it here.
There is nothing wrong with a heavily armed civilian populace. “An armed society is a polite society” as the saying goes.
FWIW, during the Cold War, when the Soviets were making war plans, one they scratched off the list right away was an actual invasion of the US. The reason? Because we are heavily armed.
If nothing else, at the end of the day, the reason our elites don’t oppress as as much as the British and European elite oppress their natives is not because they don’t hate us. They do, very much. It’s because in this country of 330 million people, there are 400 million legal arms.
George. You are sprouting all the gun lobby’s nonsense. And that nonsense would have been fine, if it didnt cost the lives of 17,000 Americans, plus 80,000 injuries. It would make sense, if you were being paid by the gun sellers, but if you’re not, you are contributing to the loss of life for nothing.
If you need guns, to have a “polite society”, then your teachers and parents have failed you. Being polite only because the other guy might have a gun, is only evidence of a coward.
The Soviets never planned a land invasion of the US. The only plan of the Soviet Union and America was to neuclear bomb the adversary to extinction. Do you actually think that guns in the hands of couch surfing Americans would have detered a neuclear power?
Europeans are mujch less “oppressed” than we are. Look up freedomhouse.org for statistics on who’s freer. America has sunk the “partly free” level, while Western Europeans, Australians, Canadians are all categorized as free.
The rules for gun ownership should be strict and enforced and limits should be set on types of guns privately owned. But the number one reason the government thinks twice on imposing more oppressive rules is exactly this gun ownership.
Nick. More than 75% of gun owners agree that we need pre-purchase vetting. What person in their right mind would believe that if everyone was armed, it would be a safer country. You can’t have a society where the fastest draw gets to live another day, ala John Wayne. You can’t depend on every Tom, Dick or Harry that he’ll always be sane enough, or have the mental acuity, to know when to shoot and under what circumstances.
The Supreme Court’s conservative majority is reading the 2nd amedment’s second part, disregarding the first, where it says a “well regulated militia, being necessary for a free state”. In the late 18th century, there was no police force, or regular army. The state depended on all males to be ready to be armed and ready, to create possies, to catch criminals, kill bears or wolves that menaced towns, and defend against Inndian attacks.
Today’s militia is the various police forces. The founders had no idea that society would develop as it has. The NRA, beggining in the 1970’s morphed into a gun lobby, instead of a gun safety proponent which was its duty up to that time. Justice Burger had said that the interpretation of the second amendment as if it permits unrestricted gun ownership was the biggest scam in America.